Proposal to merge Prism with New/Dark Horizons

[David A. Riley]

It was suggested at the BFS AGM that, to save on printing costs, it might be a good idea to merge Prism as a supplement to both New Horizons and Dark Horizons, rather than have it printed as a separate publication.

It would be interesting to hear what members of the BFS think of this proposal.

I would add that I doubt if this will happen immediately, but it is something which is being costed up to see if it will make any serious savings.

Thoughts?

[Jen]

Really not sure about the merging thing.  I much prefer an E-prism option.  As I recall, the BSFA put their newsletter completely online, leaving them two print publications to send out to members.  Ian Whates would be the man to ask about how that worked out for them, I think.  (They have it locked up in a members only access area.)

But, personally, I would much rather see the Prism content up on the website (and free for non members to access) as then you'd have lots of juicy stuff to make people come back for, which keeps the BFS looking current and would improve our appeal.  You could stagger the columnists, have one a month, say.  And the reviews and news items are much better served being online so they're more immediate.  Plus putting the interviews up pulls in the fans of the people being interviewed and they may stay and look around once they've read about their fave author.

Having it all on the website would mean that Prism would no longer be a members only thing, which, I think, would actually be a good thing.  We have other things we can use as member perks, and, as discussed at the AGM yesterday, we need to look at what else we can be offering.

We could maybe have BFS News sections in both DH & NH though.

[Peter Coleborn]

My views tend to fluctuate a little. But as you're twisting my arm:

The news and reviews section should become an e-publication (with their own sections on the BFS website rather than ad hoc postings). The columns should then go into New and Dark Horizons -- with a good balance between dark and light fantasy. I know that this looks as if you (David Riley) will be out of a job, but not necessarily so: there is a need for someone to solicit and edit the news before posting, to ensure consistency in appearance, grammar, etc. The ePrism would become the basis of Martin's monthly emailing.

NH and DH should be roughly the same size in page count and be printed by the same printer to ensure similarity in paper quality and print quality. The money saved by not having a paper-Prism could be used to add pages to NH and DH.

[Peter Coleborn]

Was there was a suggestion that Dark and New Horizons could become one annual publication, similar to the Yearbook, rather than separate publications (at least, that's the impression I got from some comments at the AGM)? I'm not happy with this idea. I like to receive quarterly magazines. The Yearbook (or whatever replaces it) should be an addition to the subscription's regular benefits.

[LouM]

Was there was a suggestion that Dark and New Horizons could become one annual publication, similar to the Yearbook, rather than separate publications (at least, that's the impression I got from some comments at the AGM)? I'm not happy with this idea. I like to receive quarterly magazines. The Yearbook (or whatever replaces it) should be an addition to the subscription's regular benefits.

I don't think that was necessarily a serious suggestion, Peter - I think it was more a sort of example, wasn't it?

I'm not entirely convinced by having the newsletter online - but that's a personal thing. I do look at the website regularly, and I agree posting content from the journals online is worthwhile - but... given that Jen's mentioned the BSFA, I'd comment that the fact their newsletter is entirely web-based is one of the reasons I've not got round to renewing my membership.

My Best Version (which, as you can see, is extra-groovy because it's got Capital Letters in it) if you're considering a merger, is to have a Prism section within each DH & NH, still edited by David.

I do think we should be cross-posting interviews and reviews onto the website (I loved the idea of a snippet or a trimmed-down interview, like the one Jen did with A de B, with the full version in the journals). It keeps us current, gives us a wide range of content and acts as a teaser to encourage new members. Bear in mind that via blogs, Facebook, Twitter & so on, all the information on our site can be spread incredibly rapidly over a wide area. I'm not entirely convinced that making all of it free is a sustainable idea (hey, if it's all available for nothing, why join?) but neither do I entirely favour the idea of having to log-in to a members-only area each time (see my comments about the BSFA). However, this is entirely personal opinion and I'm just one member, so. 

[/tuppence worth]

[David A. Riley]

My views tend to fluctuate a little. But as you're twisting my arm:

The news and reviews section should become an e-publication (with their own sections on the BFS website rather than ad hoc postings). The columns should then go into New and Dark Horizons -- with a good balance between dark and light fantasy. I know that this looks as if you (David Riley) will be out of a job, but not necessarily so: there is a need for someone to solicit and edit the news before posting, to ensure consistency in appearance, grammar, etc. The ePrism would become the basis of Martin's monthly emailing.

NH and DH should be roughly the same size in page count and be printed by the same printer to ensure similarity in paper quality and print quality. The money saved by not having a paper-Prism could be used to add pages to NH and DH.

It wouldn't bother me if any changes put me out of a job as editor of Prism if they were beneficial financially and otherwise for the BFS. I even said things in favour of changes like this during the period between being made editor and publishing the first issue this year.

One of my main concerns at the moment, though, is to get more up to date reviews. Some of those I've been given recently for Prism have been of books published in 2009 - which is too long ago in my view.

[Stephen Theaker]

I was very much against cancelling Prism at Christmas, and the reason for that was that we'd failed to deliver two consecutive issues to members. We'd broken our promise to members, and the answer to that wasn't to break our promise again.

But it's a bit different now: we've been doing a good job this year, and there's no reason not to change things if David thinks it'll provide a better service.

[Selina]

But, personally, I would much rather see the Prism content up on the website (and free for non members to access) as then you'd have lots of juicy stuff to make people come back for, which keeps the BFS looking current and would improve our appeal.  You could stagger the columnists, have one a month, say.  And the reviews and news items are much better served being online so they're more immediate.  Plus putting the interviews up pulls in the fans of the people being interviewed and they may stay and look around once they've read about their fave author.

I'd agree with this. Especially as in order to do reviews we need to get review copies & publishers like to see/link to reviews as soon as they are available, not several months down the line.

I like DH & NH as they are & think they are the much more enticing membership perk.

[David A. Riley]

I am far from sure about just an e version of Prism. Although those of us who use this forum may be happy with it, I think it's obvious that the majority of members don't come here at all and it's problematic just how many even look at the website on a regular basis. Print is still the most popular medium for reading about things, and it will probably be quite some time before that changes - if ever.

We should bear in mind that those of us who do come here do represent a minority unfortunately.

I think the idea of adding Prism on as a supplement - a quite thick supplement - to the end of Dark Horizons and New Horizons would not only make substantial printing cost savings, but also give members a very substantial publication, possibly much more impressive than the two separate publications they get now.

[Stephen Theaker]

I'm reluctant to contribute to the discussion, because if I really wanted the BFS to take the direction I want, I should have stood for chair... And in fact I don't feel all that strongly either way on the issue, except in so far as some of the suggestions would tend to increase my workload. 

But to add a few figures and stuff to the discussion...

- Dark Horizons 56 cost £456 to print and was 128pp long.
- Dark Horizons 55 cost £539 to print and was 160pp long.
- Prism 2010/2 cost £445 to print and was 56pp long.

So, on the bare figures, tucking Prism into the back of Dark Horizons would save in the region of £300 an issue. But that's been the case for years. So why is Prism still around?

I think it comes down to the fact that folding Prism into Dark Horizons or making it an epublication or putting it all online would save us money, but wouldn't save us any work at all (except in the despatching). Instead, whatever we did instead with the money would require extra work.

Of the things the BFS would like to do, but can't, only a few are down to a lack of money. The vast majority of it is down to a lack of time.

What's changed I think is that we have quite a few members – and perhaps a majority of the committee – who consider one of the former (i.e. an annual hardback anthology) more desirable than a regular newsletter.

I'd prefer the newsletters (or using the money saved to lower the cost of membership), but it's been two or three years since I last paid a membership fee at all, being on the committee, and what paying members want matters more than what I'd want. Hard as that is for me to accept. 

[David A. Riley]

I was very surprised at those comparison figures, Stephen. Going off them, it's obvious that the printer being used for Prism is either overcharging by comparison to DH and NH or, it would be more cost-effective to have more than 56 pages printed.

I never realised that Prism was costing a disproportionate amount such as this. I had thought, by discontinuing the use of colour covers, there would be some significant savings in printing costs. Obviously not. Which is, quite frankly, disappointing.

If most members would prefer one off publications like the Yearbook or Houses on the Borderland, then the choice is obvious.

David

[Stephen Theaker]

Rather than Quacks being expensive, the printers I use for Dark Horizons (Good News Digital Printing) are exceptionally cheap - that's how I was able to persuade Guy to let me increase the page count.

For comparison on the books, Houses on the Borderland cost £1386.80, plus probably another £300 for postage (it went out as a separate mailing).

The BFS Yearbook is a tough one to estimate, because of the way we didn't print enough at first, and there were payments to authors, and it was printed at the same time as another book, and so on, but my estimate is that the total cost wasn't far off £2500.

[Stephen Theaker]

I should mention that the print cost of Houses on the Borderland was for 518 copies, i.e. it included 100-200 extras for putting on sale to the public.

[David A. Riley]

I liked Houses on the Borderland and I think, as a publication, it is a credit to the BFS, though I am a bit biased, having a novelette in it.

On the other hand, I don't get the impression that this book gained much for the BFS outside the society. It made very little impact as I far as I can see and seems all but forgotten. I don't think it ever got much of a reaction, in fact, from the society's membership, if my memory serves me right. Though there does, online at least, seem to be very little ever said on this forum about any of the periodicals we put out. DH and NH included. There used to be far more of a response on the old BFS Bulletin back in the seventies when we had a letters section.

I'm sure the lack of much feedback on this forum must be a disappointment to the respective editors of DH and NH too. Sometimes I wonder whether everyone's become comatose.

[Stephen Theaker]

Nah, they're not comatose, they're all on Facebook. There's always a fair bit of comment about Dark Horizons on there.

But that's the thing with fiction - you get a book, think "that's nice" and put it on the shelf. At some point you might even pick it up and read it. I get a lot more comments on the non-fiction in Dark Horizons than the fiction.

Getting a bit off-topic now, but with that project I think it was hampered by a confusing name, and also, I would guess, looking at its Amazon page, by never being notified to the ISBN agency, so bookshops wouldn't actually have been able to order it from us. So there's a job that needs doing...